Here's an 'idea' . . .
Over in in California there has been movement to legalize same sex marriages. And with it a move to place (once again) legalizing it (or not) on this November's ballot. Here are a few thoughts from MY mind and beliefs -
While I personally am not against same sex 'marriages, we already have that, it is called 'Domestic Partnerships. All the same tax breaks and divorce rights without the title 'Married', but let us say this does pass, after all the main argument I have heard/read is that since the parties are consenting adults, what is the harm? I agree, if it isn't hurting me or isn't directly effecting ME, why should I care? I won't, for the purposes of this 'argument' bring religion into it, just stick with the laws of the land and the opinions I have heard/read.
So, as consenting adults, two people of the same sex SHOULD be allowed to marry! After all, it is between adults, right? So, while we are at it, if someone has three or FORTY women that are all adults and all want to marry one man, that should also be allowed as well. It isn't hurting anyone else, right? What about two closely (brother and sister) decide they are really in love with each other, once they reach 18, they too should be allowed to marry, right? What about if the parents child, once that age of consent is reached, decides to marry their parent, it is between adults, right, no harm no foul, as the saying goes.
Now, let's take that a little further, since this country 'loves' to allow foreign cultures to 'dictate' what is right and not in this country, since some cultures allow the very young to marry, why not here? Pretty sure I saw a documentary about a young woman in Afghanistan that was married off at the ripe old age of 11 to a man old enough to be her great grand father, and she was just one of MANY wives! Should we start that practice here as well?
Where do we draw the line? I read somewhere that some of the Great Apes (Chimps, Baboons, Gorilla's etc) have the same capacity of love that humans do, what if someone fell in love with a Chimpanzee? Would they be allowed marriage rights if they could 'prove' the love went both ways? Where do we draw the line, and do we even have the right to DRAW that line?
As I said before, I won't bring religion into my argument, because, as you can read, I don't think I needed to. However, feel free to fire that first shot, just remember; I did not! I could have, perhaps I should have, but I did not.
What are YOUR thoughts?
Comments
ok, ok I see your point, ...
ok, ok I see your point, but so opening the door to gay marriage will then "start" some other trend of people marrying people who otherwise would NOT and should NOT be married, i.e. siblings...well I don't think it'll get THAT bad...but hey never say never...LOL!!
generally, i agree with ...
generally, i agree with you, walter. as nasty as that is to us, its perfectly normal to them (i am refering to brother/sister marriage, chimp/human marriage, etc.). love is a wierd thing. it can happen to anyone at anytime towards anyone/anything. if you are TRULY in love with that person, by all means, go for it. probably best not to announce to the world you are married to your mother, but go for it. *gag*
gay marriage i have NO problems with at all. thats their lifestyle and i have no reason to judge. i think its great if a gay couple wants to make that kind of commitment.
<p>I couldn't agree more. ...
I couldn't agree more. I mean next thing ya know we'll have people of different religions marrying, people of different races marrying! Oh my GOD, we'll have tall and short people, thin and fat people marrying. Can you picture it now? A tall skinny black baptist marrying a short fat white atheist? The whole world will come to and end!!!
I propose only people who are exactly the same everything except gender and family be allowed to marry. Then we'll have a perfect world. Yup. There ya go. That's the answer. We'll all be able to sleep better at night knowing no one who doesn't "belong" together will be together. Laws always stop people from violating them so let's start passing more of them and ensure that perfect world.
(And just in case anyone took any of that seriously Hear THIS - "slippery slope arguments" are for people with all kinds of messed up slippery gears in their own little minds. Using the "slippery slope" argument, no one would ever be allowed to own a water pistol because it would lead to them having their own personal cruise missile. It is ILL logic that is exactly that fucked up. It is based on something completely unrelated. Allowing one thing allows that thing and that only, like allowing people to drive at 16. That does NOT mean that we will then begin to allow people to drive at 15 and then 14 and then 13 and so on until we allow infants to get behind the wheel. Only people with very messed up logic believe that's how it works).
Where do we draw the line? ...
Where do we draw the line? It's already been drawn, its illegal to have multiple wives and to have sex with with an animal. It's illegal to marry a sibiling or relative, not to metion harmful to any potential offspring. Homosexuality is not illegal, with that in mind how can we deny them basic rights?
Marriage and civil unions are NOT the same thing, civil unions don't grant the same rights as a marriage would. Civil unions don't give gay couples the same tax benefits that married couples get nor do they allow the health insurance benefits that a straight couple would enjoy. I strongly advise those of you opposed to same sex marriage to go to BlockBuster to rent a documentary called "Tying the Knot". Its all about partners not having any legal standing to property and possessions from a deceased partner. We had a gay couple that lived down the street from us, one of the men died in a car accident. The dead man's family raced in to try and take everything (house, cars, furniture, even the dogs), had these men been legally married the estate would have automatically gone to his partner. Keep in mind the family disowned this man but still had legal rights to his assets, the partner is now in court fighting all this. The sad part is that by the end of this all there will be little left to the estate. Civil Unions will help a little but don't offer anywhere near the legal protections that marriage does and that is what is at issue here.
What are people so afraid of when comes to gay marriage? We're talking about roughly 5% of the population, allowing them to marry isn't going to cause the fall of humanity. I would also point out that when we pass these anti-gay marriage laws they usually take away the common law marriage clauses as well. So ladies if you buy a house with your boyfriend and he dies then you may have no legal right to the house.
Hey, Walter--- do you have ...
Hey, Walter--- do you have a picture of those "messed up slippery gears in your head"? I'd love to see it. BTW--- TGIX couldn't possibly have insulted us could he?
wADV, I disagree. Marriage ...
wADV, I disagree. Marriage is not just a religious ceremony, its also a a legal contract. You can marry in a church but not have legal recognition by the government and vice versa. Technically its both or one or the other.
<p>Well, I'm sure none of ...
Well, I'm sure none of you will be surprised to hear my response. Again, I am a born-again, Bible-believing Christian. Please do not read into this that I believe I am perfect, sinless, or without fault. Quite the contrary is true. I KNOW full-well that I am very flawed, far from perfect, and, even though I am a Christian, I still sin. However, I try to include God and His Word in everything I do so that what pleases Him is more important than what pleases me.
I have to say, with all of the talk about rights, quite frankly, none of us even have the "right" to draw breath into our lungs. That is a privilege and a blessing. Just because we can "legally" do some things does not mean that we have the "right" to do those things, as in the case of same sex relationships.
Our (people as a whole) beliefs that we are free to live as we want as long as it doesn't hurt someone else is not always the appropriate thought process to hold. God created Adam from the dust of the ground, and because HE knew that it wasn't good for Adam to be alone, HE caused a great sleep to come over Adam and then HE took one of Adam's ribs and created Eve. He did not create another male for Adam, He created a female -- the perfect counter and compliment to the male, Adam.
When we desire to live as best we can by the laws of God's Word, we will encounter far fewer consequences to inappropriate decisions. As we mentioned in another post, if no one had EVER engaged in pre-marital or extra-marital sex, there would be no reason to fear contracting STDs, losing your family to divorce because of infidelity, living in fear, unplanned pregnancies resulting in abortion or children born out-of-wedlock, etc. Our belief system and the actions we live out because of those beliefs is what has brought on such consequences. And because we believe that we have the "right" to live as WE want, we are unconcerned that others are being hurt by our actions.
We could realistically volley this subject back and forth for hours, but the most important question in my mind is, "Just because I have the RIGHT to do it (or thinking I have the right, anyway,) does that MAKE it right for me to do it?"
I find it interesting that ...
I find it interesting that so many "Christians" rail against homsexuality and forget about the rest of the things the bible says.
1. The Bible expressly forbids women wearing men's clothing. Have you ever worn your husband's slippers to get the paper? Ever wore his T-shirt to bed? Then you've commited an abomination against God, this is listed in leviticus.
2. The Bible also clearly states eating "unclean food" is also an abomination. Unclean foods include crab legs, shrimp, and lobster.
Damn, looks like they better close down Red Lobster, right?
The Bible was not written by God but by men who took centuries to finalize it. Did you know there bible verses that were excluded from the Bible? How many versions of the Bible are there? The Jewish Bible is very different from the King James version, if the bible is god's word and that word is absolute then how can there be different versions?
<p>Rkinne, I am not a ...
Rkinne, I am not a "Christian," I am a Christian. And you are correct about Levitical law. However, we are not made righteous by keeping the law as in former times, we are made righteous by the shed blood of Jesus Who died for our sins. This is GRACE. We are saved by the grace of God, through our faith in Christ.
Again, you are correct in that the Bible was written by men, but it was written by men who were inspired BY GOD. There are many versions of the Bible, some of which have omitted verses that do not change the translation of the Word. All in all, the foundation of any translation of the Bible today is that in Old Testament times, people lived under the law. To be cleansed of their sin, they had to offer a sacrifice once yearly. Realistically there was no way then (and no way now) that a human could keep all of God's laws. This is why they must offer a sacrifice. Today, I live under grace. Jesus, as the perfect Lamb of God, died once and for all to be MY sacrifice. I do not have to find an animal without spot or blemish to offer in atonement for my sins.
personally, i dont believe ...
personally, i dont believe in the bible. it is a book of stories passed down. fables. thats how i perceive it. but again...thats personal opinion. im not going around dissing people who believe in the bible being the word of God. i think its great christians, catholics, jews, etc. believe in something as big as that and have such a faith in it. but i cant blindly believe in something like that.
but arent we supposed to keep religion out of this post? lol.
Nah, Conana, only WALTER ...
Nah, Conana, only WALTER promised to keep religion out of it, lol! Out of curiosity, have you never wondered if the Bible might really be true? What might happen if you were to consider its truth even a possibility?
haha, true that. walter ...
haha, true that. walter seems to have stuck by his promise. lol.
of course ive wondered if its true. i dont doubt that there are true historical events and people in there.
what would hapeen if i consider its truth a possibility?? i assume i would become a practicing catholic again (not that i really ever was, but 4 years in catholic high school and 8 years in CCD counts as sort of practicing, right?). ive never been one to get into the whole religion thing. not really sure exactly why. just isnt my "thing." it doesnt make me feel warm and fuzzy. i dont feel any better by having religion in my life. ive tried. i really have. after i graduated i went to church a few times and i just dont get it. ive thought about buddhism. THAT sounds like something i can get into. but catholicism/christianity (same thing if you ask me) was never an interest to me. i just go about my life without a care or thought in the world. maybe ive managed to find my own inner peace without the help of God. i dont know. but i feel fullfilled without it. :-)
my step-grandma, miss crazy christian, likes to say things like, "OH! the flowers have bloomed because Jesus wants them to!" things like that. i look at a bloomed flower and say, "now that is pretty!" and i sniff it. i guess ignorance IS bliss. :-D
<p>LOL!! don't you just ...
LOL!! don't you just love those christian old people!
well, my oldest is 13 and any other time she'd be making her Confirmation BUT the archbishop, in his infinite "wisdom", has changed the age here for them to be confirmed from 8th grade to 11th GRADE!! he said that he didn't think they were ready yet at 13 to understand their Confirmation. WELL guess what? NOW he's not gonna hardly have ANYBODY making it now UNLESS they're already in Catholic high school, which my daughter IS NOT IN. so I told her it would be her choice if she wanted to continue with the CCD where she is now or if she wants to forgo getting confirmed. the lady at the ccd said that ever since the archbishop made that change, enrollment drops SEVERELY after 8th grade!! go figure! she said she wished he'd change it back, ESP. since enrollment was already low since the hurricane anyway!
how wierd to make it 11th ...
how wierd to make it 11th grade. like they understand much better. all i knew when i was making my confirmation is that it was a sacriment that was required for me to complete in order to be....something. i dont remember WHY we had to complete it. rules from God or something. haha, maybe the grade SHOULD be 11th. lol. then again, my memory is worse than an 80 year old.......seriously.
I think the only time ...
I think the only time people should be allowed to get married is if they want to have kids. You don't have to be married to someone to love them or spend the rest of your life with them. You can do that without marriage. I think marriage is needed when kids are involved because, for tax purposes, it's kinda like a business. When two people are married and divorce there is the "this is mine, that is yours" crap. If there's kids involved I see the reason for all that. If people only got married with the intent of having kids then the divorce rate would be down, and there would be less divorce attorneys. We all know that less lawyers is good!
Oh - I also think it ...
Oh - I also think it should be a law that every marriage has pre-nups.
whats NAMBLA?
whats NAMBLA?
OMG South Park had the ...
OMG South Park had the FUNNIEST episode about NAMBLA....
It's North American Man/Boy Love Association
nambla is aka boy ...
nambla is aka boy scouts....sorry, just kidding...
<p>HOW the EFF can such an ...
HOW the EFF can such an organization really exist!! isn't it against the law for that type of relationship to exist (man and boy love)??!!
I knew you were out there ...
I knew you were out there somewhere waiting to respond, Walter! Glad to hear from ya! How come you left me for so long to defend the Christians, lol? Anyway...great response!
Not that I minded, though ...
Not that I minded, though (about defending the Christians.) In this day and age, it comes with the territory, lol.